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"Thriller" Album Release / "Smash Hits" Magazine Interview

Date assessed by the fact that Mark Ellen, at the beginning of this midnight call, says that he has a copy, and that the album is “about to be” in stores / Published December 1982

“Thriller” Album Release:

Janet Jackson, sister, “Larry King Live” (March 16, 2008) (archived)

Larry King: When that came out, when it was recorded, did you think it would be what it became?

Janet Jackson: I knew I loved it. I knew that I loved it. As a matter of fact, he played, as he always did when we were very close growing up, and every time he would complete a project, he would play the entire album. He had a great sound system in his car. We would sit in the car and we would listen to the album from front to back. I loved every song I heard.

"Smash Hits" Magazine Interview:

“Smash Hits” Special Tribute Issue (July 2009) (mirror) (archived mirror)

It’s just gone midnight in the Smash Hits office when a young Mark Ellen picks up the phone. At the other end, live from Los Angeles, is an even younger Michael Jackson, whose new LP “Thriller” has just been released. Their 35-minute conversation has gone down in history as Michael’s last-ever British interview. Now, 25 years later, we reprint their classic exchange in full.

Mark Ellen: Your new LP “Thriller”, is out in Britain. Are you pleased with it?

Michael Jackson: It’s out already?

Mark: I’ve got a copy.

Michael: In the stores?

Mark: Well, it’s about to be. Are you pleased with it?

Michael: Oh, yeah, I’m pleased with it. I’m hap… I’m the kind of person that is never satisfied.

Mark: Which are your favourite tracks?

Michael: My favourite tracks are “Thriller”, um, “Billie Jean”, “Beat It”, “Starting Something”, “The Lady In My Life”. Stuff like that.

Mark: There’s all sorts of extraordinary people on it, Vincent Price, for instance. How come you worked with him?

Michael: I’ve known Vincent ever since I was 11 years old. And when you think of “Thriller”… I mean who’s the king of horror who’s still alive? I mean Bela Lugosi and Peter Lorre are dead now and the only giant who goes back to those days is Vincent Price so I thought he was the perfect voice. Actually it was Rod Temperton and Quincy (Jones) who actually thought of him ‘cause he is a friend and everything. He came in right away, it was no problem.

Mark: How about Eddie Van Halen?

Michael: I wrote a song called “Beat It” and we wanted a great solo, a guitar solo, so that night Quincy said, I have a great idea, um, um, you know, someone like Van Halen would be a good idea or Peter Townshend but Townshend and The Who are touring at the moment so we thought it would be a problem. So the next day, the very next day, Eddie was in the studio. He’s the kind of guy that kept worrying that his part was OK and he wanted to be just right. He’s a perfectionist.

Mark: How do you choose the songs?

Michael: Whatever’s the best. Whatever’s the best for today’s sound and today’s market. If it touches us personally we go ahead with it. And if I personally like it and Quincy personally likes it.

Mark: What qualities do you look for in the songs?

Michael: I just look for the music to be outstanding and especially, more than anything, the melody.

Mark: Who offered you songs that you didn’t accept? I heard there was one by Stevie Wonder?

Michael: Well, Stevie had one which was good. It was a good song, more a danceable-type thing. There was also… ah, what’s his name?

Mark: David Grant?

Michael: I forget (laughs). There’s so much going on I forget. Steve is incredible. We went with a more danceable one but the song was great.

Mark: Why did you choose the title “Thriller”? You like movies a lot?

Michael: I love movies. All movies. But I don’t like scary movies.

Mark: Why not?

Michael: I can’t sleep after watching one, it just scares me.

Mark: What are your favorite movies?

Michael: Any Steven Spielberg movie.

Mark: Do you like E.T.?

Michael: I love E.T.

Mark: Why do you love it so much?

Michael: ‘Cause it reminds me of me. The whole story, you know, someone from another world coming down and you becoming friends with them and this person’s like 800 years old and he’s filling you with all kinds of wisdom and he’s magic and he can teach you how to fly. It’s that whole fantasy thing that I think is great. I mean who doesn't want to fly?

Mark: What other films do you like?

Michael: I like the old MGM musicals. I like things with great acting, like Katharine Hepburn, Spencer Tracy. I love Oliver! One of my friends lives there (England) - Mark Lester. He’s a friend of mine. Oliver! is one of my favourite films of all time. When he’s here, I visit him and we talk on the phone.

Mark: Why do you like that film in particular so much?

Michael: Ooooooh! It’s terrific! It’s Dickens’ story. I mean… it’s… it’s incredible. Lionel Bart’s music is unreal… it’s magic. I’m going to record that song in the future, one of the songs…

Mark: Which one?

Michael: “Where is love?”

Mark: Do you know other movie stars?

Michael: Yeah, being in the same field. Katharine Hepburn came to our concert on the last tour. That was the first concert she’d ever seen. The press were surprised. You know an actress of her stature and the whole Hollywood thing. They were surprised that she would even show up. That was the first concert that she’d ever been to.

Mark: What did she say about it?

Michael: She loved it. He told me she loved it and she asked me to come to dinner the next day but we had to move in to the next city, you know.

Mark: Do you have a hero or a heroine in movies that you would really like to meet?

Michael: Well, I wanted to meet Walt Disney but he died. And I wanted to meet Charlie Chaplin but he died. There’s nobody that I would really want to meet. I’m gonna work with Steven Spielberg.

Mark: Really. Doing what?

Michael: A film. We’re going to do a film together. He’s just putting the story and ideas together gradually working on ideas. You know I did the “E.T. Storybook” album and we just finished that. He and Quincy directed the whole thing, you know.

Mark: You haven’t done any acting since The Wiz, have you?

Michael: Right.

Mark: You’re looking forward to doing some more?

Michael: Oh, yeah.

Mark: Obviously most of your time, you’re involved in making music. What else are you interested in?

Michael: I don’t know really. It’s hard to take a break… ‘cause I’m always creating stuff… songwriting… and that’s mainly what I do (laughs) and I’m interested in films and acting and that sort of thing… I don’t really involve in sports or any of that stuff…

Mark: Whereabouts do you live?

Michael: We live in the valley of California.

Mark: What’s it like there?

Michael: It’s, ah, lots of orange trees and lots of lemon trees. The whole valley used to be an orange grove so everywhere you see is orange trees. And, ah, right now (laughs) there’s some mud ‘cause it’ been raining this morning but it’s nice and clear now, there’s blue skies out… and wind.

Mark: What kind of music do you listen to?

Michael: I like all music, all music. From classical to country to pop. I love Paul McCartney’s early solo stuff a lot.

Mark: You worked with him?

Michael: Oh yeah, it was a lot of fun. He’s wonderful. Linda’s very nice too. The whole family. Could you say “Hi” to them from me from America?

Mark: You’ve been so fantastically successful, do you feel you have a lot to live up to? Would you be upset if this LP wasn’t as successful as the last?

Michael: Um, Yeah. ‘Cause I always like to improve. I don’t like to take a step backwards. But it’s a whole ‘nother economy now…

Mark: You mean people aren’t buying as many records?

Michael: Yeah. That’s no excuse though.

Mark: In the ‘70s, why do you think you became so successful?

Michael: Probably that we were doing good songs, that we were fresh and new and different and we were real young. And I don’t think that there was anything else like that out there. The Osmonds, they came along but they were like a copy of what we did. I like watching them - I’m not saying they weren’t good - I enjoyed what they did.

Mark: Do you still see your brothers?

Michael: Yeah.

Mark: And you still get along?

Michael: Very well.

Mark: In the late ‘70s, you were very representative of the “disco boom”. Is that something you’d like to get away from now?

Michael: I don’t think I do represent “disco”. We were doing ballads and all kinds of stuff. I wouldn’t call “One Day In Your Life” disco or “Never Can Say Goodbye” or “Rock With You”… um… um… I just like good dance music. They can label it whatever they want but as long as it’s dance music and people like it…

Mark: What English groups do you like?

Michael: I like Adam Ant’s drums. He’s a friend of mine also.

Mark: Didn’t you swap jackets or something?

Michael: Yes (laughs). I was bugging him a long time about his jackets, yeah. (Gives a little shriek of pleasure at the memory.) Yeah, we talk over the phone a lot. I love his drums on his songs. Will you say “Hi” to him from me, too?

Mark: How did you come to meet him?

Michael: I’ve never met him. We’re phone friends. Whenever he’s here he calls me. Like he calls me from the Greek theatre. When I’m in England I call him and we talk like we’ve known each other for years but we’ve never met or seen each other eye to eye.

Mark: Wouldn’t you like to meet him?

Michael: Yeah, I would, if our schedules meet (laughs).

Mark: What do you talk about?

Michael: We talk about different musical stuff and how to record drums and the sound he got on “Ant Music”. He likes my stuff and I like his and he talks about my dancing and I talk about his dressing.

Mark: Do you have a very technical approach to your music then?

Michael: No.

Mark: An emotional one then?

Michael: Yeah, it comes straight from the heart.

Mark: What’s the track that you’ve been most pleased with?

Michael: Probably on “Thriller”, “Baby Be Mine”. Actually, I can’t answer that ‘cause I’m never really pleased, never totally satisfied. I’m a real perfectionist.

Mark: Who would you like to work with that you haven’t yet?

Michael: Streisand is an example. We’re going to be doing a duet together. We’ll be writing it together. I love her singing.

Mark: What about Paul McCartney and Rupert Bear?

Michael: We talked about it a lot but I didn’t come to a decision on working on it. Sweet character…

Mark: Who? Rupert?

Michael: Yeah. He seems so innocent and charming, like no matter what he’s OK. And, you know, I got a couple of books here for Paul on Rupert. He’s real charming. He always reminds me of Winnie the Pooh.

Mark: Do you read a lot of books?

Michael: Yeah.

Mark: You’re obviously very interested in magical things and stories?

Michael: I love fairy tales. I like fantasy a lot, science fiction, I like magic. I like to create magic. I love magic. It doesn’t matter what you do, it’s got to be magic. Something that the person hears it or sees it, they’re just totally blown away. The unexpected is what I like.

Mark: Any particular writers?

Michael: I like J.M. Barrie. Mostly the older guys who aren’t here anymore. Their imagination was just out of this world. Frank Baum who did the Oz books. I love Steven Spielberg, he’s the modern day Walt Disney. I gave Steven a great book which you can’t buy in the stores. It’s like this old company that used to make these set of books called Wisdom and it’s very hard to find them, but it’s the cover story, the hard-book story of Walt Disney and I gave it to Steven. And I wrote an inscription in it and he liked it so much, he said it was the best present he’d ever gotten. He told me he reads it every night before he goes to bed. At the back of it there’s all these quotations, like things Disney has said in interviews, like words of wisdom, like three whole pages, and we were just reading them together on the aeroplane. I mean he loves it. It’s a great book.

Mark: What did you inscribe in it?

Michael: I told Steven how Disney was one of the people who inspired me the most in my music and in so many things and that I felt that nobody has ever come along since Disney has died with his imagination and to fill his shoes and he, Steven Spielberg, was the only person who had inspired me like Walt Disney had inspired me. He gave me a big hug and everything. I mean he was great, he loves it, he says it’s the best present he ever got.

Mark: So you’re good friends?

Michael: Oh yeah, I mean every word of it.

Mark: When are you going to start filming?

Michael: Probably after The Jacksons’ album which we’ll start working on in January. Sometime after that we’ll just finalise the story and start moving. He’s making an animated movie, Steven; he wants me to come up with the story for it (giggles). He told me to start thinking of ideas ‘cause he wants me to work on it and I said, great. So I’ve been thinking like crazy.

Mark: What sort of part will you play in the film he’s making with you?

Michael: Gosh, I don’t know. It’s a futuristic fantasy-type of thing but they’re still not sure of the story so I don’t know the role or anything.

Mark: Do you go out much in public?

Michael: No, I don’t. I don’t go out.

Mark: So you watch films at home?

Michael: Yeah, we have a movie room. I saw a movie last night in our theatre. We have a theatre in the house where we have film shows. It seats like 32 people and if I want to see E.T. or something I just have it ordered, whatever I like to see.

Mark: Is your house big?

Michael: Ah, yeah, I guess. (giggles with embarrassment)

Mark: What other rooms are there?

Michael: We have a library. We have an exercise room… and Disney’s going to do a whole thing for me, The Pirates Of The Caribbean, in a display room. They’re going to have different parts of the Caribbean thing put in my game room. They never do stuff so I felt honoured that they’re going to do it for me. They’re going to put it in.

Mark: What, all the props?

Michael: “Animatronics” - where the faces move, the figures move, the eyebrows move, and their eyes and their bodies, and they shoot… When you step in this room there’ll be a whole war going on… Cannons shooting off and smoke puffing at one another and fighting… a whole war going on.

Mark: And that’s all going to be set up in your room?

Michael: Yup.

Mark: As an exhibition or just for you?

Michael: For me and for company. For whoever comes and wants to see it. They’re going to do the sound and the lighting and everything. Then there’s this games room…

Mark: What sort of games have you got in there?

Michael: Space Invaders and Star Fire and basketball games.

Mark: Are you good at them?

Michael: I’m good until some little kid comes along and beats me (laughs).

Mark: And there’s an exercise room?

Michael: Yeah. I don’t do exercise but it’s there for other people. A sauna and stuff like that. It’s just a place where, after you work hard, you can come and relax and have a good time and entertain your friends.

Mark: Who do you live with?

Michael: Just my mother and my two sisters and my father. I still live with my folks. I’d die of loneliness if I moved out. Plus I couldn’t control the fans and stuff. I’d be surrounded. I’d never leave the house but here there’s guards. Security… a whole set-up.

Mark: So you rarely go out?

Michael: Very rarely.

Mark: Do you ever get mobbed?

Michael: Oh, yes.

Mark: Is it frightening?

Michael: No, it’s more fun ‘cause you get to turn and beck and hide. But once they get you trapped it’s not fun.

Mark: What happens then?

Michael: They start kissing you and pulling you and tearing your clothes and tearing your hair out of your head… I’ve gone to certain countries and I’ll walk along and there’s a fan and she’ll go, “Oh my God!” and she’ll show me a piece of hair and say, “I took this out of your head two years ago”, this piece of hair in her wallet.

Mark: How do you feel about things like that?

Michael: I don’t know… it’s strange.

Mark: So how do you travel? Do you fly and drive everywhere?

Michael: Yeah and we have security with us. We have a private jet.

Mark: And you have bodyguards, presumably?

Michael: Yeah, I have to.

Mark: Would you say you lived a normal life?

Michael: Ah, no, I can’t say that.

Mark: Do you ever long to lead a normal life?

Michael: No, I’m happy the way I am. I’m happy the way I am.

Mark: Do you like groups like The Human League and Soft Cell?

Michael: Yeah, I like those groups. I like ‘em. My favourite English group will always be The Beatles ‘cause they had real good songs. A lot of the bands today have more musical sounds and different sounds and things you’ve never heard, but melody and great lyrics is not there. They always had great melody and lyrics - even if it was just a harmonica playing in the background, the melody was the feature of the whole song.

Mark: What’s your favourite Beatles song?

Michael: My favourite Beatles song is Paul’s favourite Beatles song.

Mark: Which is that?

Michael: “Yesterday”. It always touched me the most. It was always special to me. I think it’s wonderful, the melody and the music and the whole feeling.

Mark: Do you think anyone’s come near The Beatles’ songwriting quality?

Michael: Yeah. Holland, Dozier; Holland.

Mark: Do you have any particular favourites of theirs?

Michael: All of them. That whole ‘60s period to me - with Simon and Garfunkel, The Beatles and Motown - was the best musical time in history.

Mark: Why?

Michael: ‘Cause they were real songs. Real good songs. Today a writer will have success and then just celebrate the rest of his life and just forget about writing ever again - no self-control, he’s partying the rest of his life. Back then people just kept trying, kept coming up with great stuff.

Mark: What about the ‘70s?

Michael: I like Elton John’s stuff - terrific. Bernie Taupin. “Yellow Brick Road” and “Bennie And The Jets”. All that stuff. That’s great stuff.

Mark: What did you like about him?

Michael: His image with the feathers and the glasses I thought was good but they were good songs. We’re good friends.

Mark: Who else do you know in England?

Michael: These are the people I visit there: Mark Lester, the McCartneys, I talk to Adam Ant a lot too on the phone. I know Elton. I know a great songwriter called Don Black…

Mark: Where will you be for Christmas?

Michael: I’ll be at home.

Mark: And what would you like?

Michael: Actually, I don’t celebrate Christmas. We just sit round the fire, watch the parade or whatever. We don’t really do anything special. We just enjoy the weather. I mean it’s 70 or 80 degrees, Christmas out here. We just don’t do anything. It’s hot. It’s burning up.

“Smash Hits” magazine (January 20, 1983)

Michael Jackson doesn’t often do interviews. This is partly because he’s much happier expressing himself his music than words; and partly because a lot of the people who actually get to meet or talk with him are left with the distinct impression that he’s just a little strange. And he is. And seeing that— at the tender age of 23 — he is already chalked up some of the most colossal sales figures in recording history, he’s got every right to be.

For much of the time, this faraway voice on the ‘phone has the high-pitched, incredulous tone of a six-year-old at a perpetual firework party. The mention of particular films, books, and songs that he likes are greeted with sudden gasps of wonder and delight as if this was the first time he’s ever encountered them. Judging by the meager portion of the ‘real world’ he’s ever really exposed to these days, it’s easy to believe that the youngest Jackson brother is actually a visitor from some distant planet.

He’s calling from his home in The Valley of California, just outside Los Angeles, where he lives with his parents, Katherine and Joe, and his two sisters. This resides in a luxurious belt of costly villas surrounded by orange and lemon groves, a little sudden, he says after a recent rainstorm.

After a full 13 years of adulation from press, fans and record company magnates—the Jackson Five first hit the jackpot in ’69 when he was just 10 — Michael’s become something of a recluse. He seems perfectly content to shut himself away in a curious fairytale world of science fiction and cartoon fantasy — or “magic” as he calls it — from which he draws the inspiration for his songwriting. ” I like things,” as he puts it, “that when a person hears or sees them, they are just totally blown away.”

The ‘mod cons’ around the house certainly bear this out. In one room there are rows of Space Invader machines; in another Walt Disney are busy installing a complete working of The Pirates Of The Caribbean, fully automated Disneyland figures who launch into lifelike combat at the mere flick of a switch.-When you step in this room,” he says. spellbound, “there‘ll be this whole war going on, cannons shooting off and smoke puffing at one another…”

Down the hall, there’s a movie theatre, a fully-blown 32-seater cinema for which he constantly orders up entertainment. The most regular visitor to the family screen is E T. which he likes so much that he actually collaborated with its director, Steven Spielberg, on the “E.T. Storybook” LP. “I love E T. ‘cos it reminds me of me,” he says mysteriously. “Someone from another world coming down and you becoming friends with them and this person is, like 800 years old and he’s filling you with all kinds of wisdom and he can teach you how to fly. That whole fantasy thing which I think is great. I mean, who don’t wanna fly?”

He and Spielberg are about to embark on a couple more joint ventures, a financial pairing that’ll no doubt put even Paul McCartney and Stevie Wonder in the shade. One’s a “futuristic fantasy type film” with Michael in an acting role; the other’s an animation for which he’ll be supplying the storyline and has been “thinking like crazy!” “I even gave Steven a present, a book on Walt Disney, as he’s the only person who’s inspired me in my music as much as Disney. He told me he loves it and gave me a big hug and everything.”

Together with Quincy Jones, who was also the musical director for the “E.T. Story-book” project, he’s just released a new LP, “Thriller”, and the second single from it, “Billie Jean”.

The album is the eventual sequel to what Epic Records rightly describe as his “landmark LP”, “Off The Wall”, which was released in 1979 and went on to sell a staggering total of seven million copies worldwide. A hard act to follow. “Yeah, well, I always like to improve,” he says. “I don’t like to take a step backward, but it’s a whole ‘nother economy now. People aren’t buying as many records, though that’s no excuse.” What qualities does he look for when selecting material then?

“For the music to be outstanding and, more than anything else, the melody. What’s best for today’s sound and today’s market.” Asked who he admires, he lists early McCartney solo material, ’60s Motown, Simon and Garfunkel, Elton John and “Adam Ant’s drums“. Adam, in fact, is one of a small but intimate circle of Michael Jackson’s friends, despite the fact that they’ve never actually met in the flesh. “We’re phone-friends,” he explains. “We talk about how to record that drum sound on ‘Ant Music’ and stuff. He talks about my dancing and I talk about his dressing”.

“Could you say ‘hi’ to him for me?” Other friends include the English actor Mark Lester, who played the starring role in the musical Oliver, Elton John, and Paul McCartney — “say ‘hi’ to him and Linda too”. He’s acquainted, also, with various film celebrities, among them 73-year-old Hollywood star Katharine Hepburn (who once saw a Jackson concert and promptly invited him to dinner) and Barbra Streisand, who he’ll be recording a duet with fairly soon. His life, however, does unto a little isolated, I suggest. A little remote.

Has he ever thought of moving away from the family home? “I’d die of loneliness if I moved out,” he says, “and, plus, I wouldn’t be able to control the fans and stuff. I’d be surrounded. But here there’s guards and security, the whole set-up“. He ventures outside ”very rarely“, and even then he’s permanently flanked by bodyguards and whisked straight off to the private jet. He talks about the hordes of admirers constantly watching his every move with extraordinary naivety.

“Is fun sometimes ‘cos you get to run and dodge and hide. But once they have you trapped it’s not fun“. As an example, he relates a chilling tale about a fan he once met who opened up her purse to reveal a lock of his hair she’d painfully removed two years before. A note of resignation creeps into his voice. You can’t say he leads a normal life. “No. I can’t say that…” Do you ever wish you could? –No-. he says quietly. “I’m happy the way I am.”